"Look, I'm a state senator who hasn't even been sworn in yet," Obama said." My understanding is that I will be ranked 99th in seniority. ... I'm going to be spending the first several months of my career in the U.S. Senate looking for the washroom and trying to figure out how the phones work." - Obama 11/4/2004 Sun-Times (emphasis added)
On March 28th, 2008 at 12:57 PM, Anonymous (not verified) said:
Wright: over.
Obama's current 8-point advantage ties his largest lead of the Gallup Poll Daily tracking program, along with a 50% to 42% showing in Feb. 28-March 1 polling. Obama clearly has weathered the Wright storm, while the dark clouds have shifted to Clinton over whether she has exaggerated her foreign policy credentials. This week she has had to defend her repeated claim that she came under sniper fire while visiting Bosnia as first lady, which news video clearly disputed.
McCain is now viewed favorably by 54% of voters nationwide and unfavorably by 43%. Obama’s reviews are 49% favorable and 49% unfavorable. For Clinton, those numbers are 45% favorable, 53% unfavorable (see recent daily results).
As I said when the story broke, I want to see how Obama does among white voters in PA, NC, IN, etc.
(By the way - the poll you link to also shows that about 28 percent of Hillary's supporters say they'll support McCain over Obama in November. But he's a uniter!)
On March 28th, 2008 at 02:53 PM, Anonymous (not verified) said:
Now compare that 49% negative to where it was a month ago today, 48%.
What a disaster! It's worse than the sinking of the S. S. Minnow! Clearly Wright is having a major negative impact!
And it should be obvious why John McBush's unfavorables aren't as low: Obama and Clinton are shooting at each other, not him. Once the nomination is decided, let's put McBush under the scope and laissez les bon temps roullez.
And experience (and poll data) shows two things in a heated primary battle: people say in March they'd rather stay home than vote should the bozo -- i.e. the other candidate -- get their party's nomination, and in November, they vote for the bozo anyway.
On March 28th, 2008 at 02:54 PM, Kevin Sandefur said:
On March 28th, 2008 at 04:23 PM, Glock21 said:
Kevin... that last one with the newspaper was *great*.
On March 29th, 2008 at 04:02 AM, Dan Fielding said:
Seconded.
On March 29th, 2008 at 10:22 AM, IlliniPundit said:
Thirded.
"Now compare that 49% negative to where it was a month ago today, 48%.
What a disaster! It's worse than the sinking of the S. S. Minnow! Clearly Wright is having a major negative impact!"
Don't you find it odd that a man whose primary reason for his candidacy is that he's a uniter who is going to change American politics is already viewed unfavorably by half the country?
On March 29th, 2008 at 10:58 AM, xian said:
What's the racial breakdown there, and what do you think the floor on that figure is? (In other words, what do you think the minimum disapproval rating for him could possibly be?)
On March 29th, 2008 at 11:29 AM, Anonymous (not verified) said:
"Unfavorably" in this case could simply mean "I'm not going to vote for him." The poll doesn't have a "neutral" category -- if you aren't with him, according to Rasmussen you're against him.
Now, when you look at a poll that actually includes a "neutral" category, the picture's a lot different. Here's a very fresh poll about Obama from the Wall Street Journal:
Very positive: 24%
Somewhat positive: 25%
Neutral: 18%
Somewhat negative: 16%
Very negative: 16%
Two things to notice. One is that when given an "neutral" option, a third of the people Rasmussen calls "negative" turn out not to be negative after all, while the positives stay positive.
For the second point, take a look at how Obama compares to Democrats in general. For context, let's take a look at another part of another recent Wall Street Journal poll, from about two weeks back, this time about "the Democratic party."
Very positive: 20%
Somewhat positive: 25%
Neutral: 18%
Somewhat negative: 16%
Very negative: 19%
So Obama's ratings are not significantly different than the ratings for Generic Democrat X. Pretty much any Democrat is likely to get numbers in this ballpark. And it's worth noting that where Obama's numbers vary, he does better, not worse, than the party as a whole.
And for completeness, let's take a look at what the same poll had to say about the miserable state of the Republican party.
Very positive: 10% (*ten* points lower than Democrats)
Somewhat positive: 24% (one point lower than Democrats)
Neutral: 15% (three points lower than Democrats)
Somewhat negative: 21% (five points higher than Democrats)
Very negative: 28% (*nine* points higher than Democrats)
But why shouldn't the GOP be taking it on the chin so badly? After all, they're slavishly devoted to the policies of a guy with a *41%* "Very negative" rating -- and now a severe economic crisis he's plainly unequipped to deal with and which may relegate his party to permanent minority status for a generation.
On March 29th, 2008 at 11:34 AM, IlliniPundit said:
"What's the racial breakdown there, and what do you think the floor on that figure is? (In other words, what do you think the minimum disapproval rating for him could possibly be?)"
Racial breakdown is usually around 10-12 percent African-American for a national voter sample, IIRC.
His disapproval/unfavorable floor is (Wild Ass Guess Alert!) probably upper-20s to low-30s, which was roughly (again, IIRC) Bill Clinton's disapproval when he left office.
On March 29th, 2008 at 12:10 PM, Anonymous (not verified) said:
It's getting nasty.Hillary and Barack are really going at it. They're insulting each other, trading barbs, attacking each other's credibility. In fact, the only break they take from attacking each other is when they promise the American people, if elected, they can unite the country.
Leno
On March 29th, 2008 at 10:25 PM, xian said:
I guess I don't see it. I don't think Obama has been attacking Clinton very much. And I'm concerned that people can't see the difference between attacking someone and questioning their arguments.
On March 30th, 2008 at 07:21 AM, Kevin Sandefur said:
Let's see... Clinton campaign lies about her record... Some journalists call them on it... Clinton campaign says media is unfair and she's being victimized.
Clinton campaign lies about Obama's record... Obama's campaign calls them on it... Clinton campaign and some Republicans claim Obama's attacking her and call him a hypocrite.
Huhn. Do I detect a pattern here?
On March 30th, 2008 at 09:50 PM, Anonymous (not verified) said:
As you know,Hillary is coming under fire for claiming she was under fire while in Bosnia. Luckily, she was wearing her Kevlar pantsuit at the time.
No, Hillary now says that she just made an honest mistake when she said she had to duck sniper fire in Bosnia. There was no hostile fire of any kind. Although, ironically, while she was away, Bill Clinton did see some action.
Do you think this is a big deal? See, all candidates exaggerate. Remember when McCain ran in 2000? Remember that? He had to retract a claim that he had been under cannon fire from the Confederates.
Of course, this has hurt Hillary's claim that she's the candidate with the most experience. Like, when Hillary said she went to 80 countries, turns out she only wanted to go to one country, but she had booked it through Priceline.com.
On March 31st, 2008 at 12:37 AM, Glock21 said:
xian... I think the big attack most people were talking about was the memo that basically had a long and detailed list of her "history of misleading voters" and mentioned more than once her "dishonesty"... I have his memo and Hillary's response here on my blog post about the "civil war" the Democratic party was in according to DailyKos's Kos and ABC. Outside of that there seemed to be a war of surrogates around the same time ripping on the other's tactics, gaffes, and such as if they were running against each other in the general. The problem for Hillary is that almost every issue of dishonesty he brought up was accurate... Hillary's response included an accusation that Obama was working to disenfranchise more voters than they think Bush did in 2000. Most of the barbs have been more subtle to be certain, but they're both tearing each other down by pointing out their flaws and weaknesses.
Hillary's response included an accusation that Obama was working to disenfranchise more voters than they think Bush did in 2000. Most of the barbs have been more subtle to be certain, but they're both tearing each other down by pointing out their flaws and weaknesses.
But this is exactly what I mean. Obama is not trying to disenfranchise anyone. He is trying to make sure that in following the rules and agreements that both he and Clinton were party to, she doesn't go back on her word and get rewarded with the nomination for essentially cheating.
There is no world in which I would support a candidate pushing to win a non-election and then demanding that the uncontested non-election be counted. That just doesn't make any sense.
If you call me a liar and I am, and then I call you a liar and you didn't do what I said you did, we aren't even. It doesn't work that way.
On March 31st, 2008 at 07:24 AM, Glock21 said:
xian... I agree, Obama is attempting no such thing, but silly things like the truth aren't going to stop her from trying to convince voters of that. The difference between Obama's attacks on Hillary versus Hillary's attacks on Obama, is that Obama's are overwhelmingly accurate and backed up by facts. Hillary's are often gross distortions or blatant attempts to create a false impression upon the voters. But there's a reason Hillary was within about 7% of Bush for being despised by Americans (very unfavorable/strong disapproval).
Obama's 3 AM Phone call:
"Look, I'm a state senator who hasn't even been sworn in yet," Obama said." My understanding is that I will be ranked 99th in seniority. ... I'm going to be spending the first several months of my career in the U.S. Senate looking for the washroom and trying to figure out how the phones work." - Obama 11/4/2004 Sun-Times (emphasis added)
Real quote, fake pic.
--
Glock21 Op/Ed
So what? It's always the humble who learn fastest.
http://www.news-gazette.com/news/opinions/letters/2008/03/28/voters_prove_they_have_poor_judgment
Wright: over.
http://www.gallup.com/poll/105814/Gallup-Daily-Obama-Back-Into-Lead-Democratic-Race.aspx
Really?
As I said when the story broke, I want to see how Obama does among white voters in PA, NC, IN, etc.
(By the way - the poll you link to also shows that about 28 percent of Hillary's supporters say they'll support McCain over Obama in November. But he's a uniter!)
Now compare that 49% negative to where it was a month ago today, 48%.
What a disaster! It's worse than the sinking of the S. S. Minnow! Clearly Wright is having a major negative impact!
And it should be obvious why John McBush's unfavorables aren't as low: Obama and Clinton are shooting at each other, not him. Once the nomination is decided, let's put McBush under the scope and laissez les bon temps roullez.
And experience (and poll data) shows two things in a heated primary battle: people say in March they'd rather stay home than vote should the bozo -- i.e. the other candidate -- get their party's nomination, and in November, they vote for the bozo anyway.
Kevin... that last one with the newspaper was *great*.
--
Glock21 Op/Ed
Seconded.
Thirded.
"Now compare that 49% negative to where it was a month ago today, 48%.
What a disaster! It's worse than the sinking of the S. S. Minnow! Clearly Wright is having a major negative impact!"
Don't you find it odd that a man whose primary reason for his candidacy is that he's a uniter who is going to change American politics is already viewed unfavorably by half the country?
What's the racial breakdown there, and what do you think the floor on that figure is? (In other words, what do you think the minimum disapproval rating for him could possibly be?)
"Unfavorably" in this case could simply mean "I'm not going to vote for him." The poll doesn't have a "neutral" category -- if you aren't with him, according to Rasmussen you're against him.
Now, when you look at a poll that actually includes a "neutral" category, the picture's a lot different. Here's a very fresh poll about Obama from the Wall Street Journal:
Very positive: 24%
Somewhat positive: 25%
Neutral: 18%
Somewhat negative: 16%
Very negative: 16%
Two things to notice. One is that when given an "neutral" option, a third of the people Rasmussen calls "negative" turn out not to be negative after all, while the positives stay positive.
For the second point, take a look at how Obama compares to Democrats in general. For context, let's take a look at another part of another recent Wall Street Journal poll, from about two weeks back, this time about "the Democratic party."
Very positive: 20%
Somewhat positive: 25%
Neutral: 18%
Somewhat negative: 16%
Very negative: 19%
So Obama's ratings are not significantly different than the ratings for Generic Democrat X. Pretty much any Democrat is likely to get numbers in this ballpark. And it's worth noting that where Obama's numbers vary, he does better, not worse, than the party as a whole.
And for completeness, let's take a look at what the same poll had to say about the miserable state of the Republican party.
Very positive: 10% (*ten* points lower than Democrats)
Somewhat positive: 24% (one point lower than Democrats)
Neutral: 15% (three points lower than Democrats)
Somewhat negative: 21% (five points higher than Democrats)
Very negative: 28% (*nine* points higher than Democrats)
But why shouldn't the GOP be taking it on the chin so badly? After all, they're slavishly devoted to the policies of a guy with a *41%* "Very negative" rating -- and now a severe economic crisis he's plainly unequipped to deal with and which may relegate his party to permanent minority status for a generation.
"What's the racial breakdown there, and what do you think the floor on that figure is? (In other words, what do you think the minimum disapproval rating for him could possibly be?)"
Racial breakdown is usually around 10-12 percent African-American for a national voter sample, IIRC.
His disapproval/unfavorable floor is (Wild Ass Guess Alert!) probably upper-20s to low-30s, which was roughly (again, IIRC) Bill Clinton's disapproval when he left office.
It's getting nasty.Hillary and Barack are really going at it. They're insulting each other, trading barbs, attacking each other's credibility. In fact, the only break they take from attacking each other is when they promise the American people, if elected, they can unite the country.
Leno
I guess I don't see it. I don't think Obama has been attacking Clinton very much. And I'm concerned that people can't see the difference between attacking someone and questioning their arguments.
Let's see... Clinton campaign lies about her record... Some journalists call them on it... Clinton campaign says media is unfair and she's being victimized.
Clinton campaign lies about Obama's record... Obama's campaign calls them on it... Clinton campaign and some Republicans claim Obama's attacking her and call him a hypocrite.
Huhn. Do I detect a pattern here?
As you know,Hillary is coming under fire for claiming she was under fire while in Bosnia. Luckily, she was wearing her Kevlar pantsuit at the time.
No, Hillary now says that she just made an honest mistake when she said she had to duck sniper fire in Bosnia. There was no hostile fire of any kind. Although, ironically, while she was away, Bill Clinton did see some action.
Do you think this is a big deal? See, all candidates exaggerate. Remember when McCain ran in 2000? Remember that? He had to retract a claim that he had been under cannon fire from the Confederates.
Of course, this has hurt Hillary's claim that she's the candidate with the most experience. Like, when Hillary said she went to 80 countries, turns out she only wanted to go to one country, but she had booked it through Priceline.com.
xian... I think the big attack most people were talking about was the memo that basically had a long and detailed list of her "history of misleading voters" and mentioned more than once her "dishonesty"... I have his memo and Hillary's response here on my blog post about the "civil war" the Democratic party was in according to DailyKos's Kos and ABC. Outside of that there seemed to be a war of surrogates around the same time ripping on the other's tactics, gaffes, and such as if they were running against each other in the general. The problem for Hillary is that almost every issue of dishonesty he brought up was accurate... Hillary's response included an accusation that Obama was working to disenfranchise more voters than they think Bush did in 2000. Most of the barbs have been more subtle to be certain, but they're both tearing each other down by pointing out their flaws and weaknesses.
--
Glock21 Op/Ed
Hillary's response included an accusation that Obama was working to disenfranchise more voters than they think Bush did in 2000. Most of the barbs have been more subtle to be certain, but they're both tearing each other down by pointing out their flaws and weaknesses.
But this is exactly what I mean. Obama is not trying to disenfranchise anyone. He is trying to make sure that in following the rules and agreements that both he and Clinton were party to, she doesn't go back on her word and get rewarded with the nomination for essentially cheating.
There is no world in which I would support a candidate pushing to win a non-election and then demanding that the uncontested non-election be counted. That just doesn't make any sense.
If you call me a liar and I am, and then I call you a liar and you didn't do what I said you did, we aren't even. It doesn't work that way.
xian... I agree, Obama is attempting no such thing, but silly things like the truth aren't going to stop her from trying to convince voters of that. The difference between Obama's attacks on Hillary versus Hillary's attacks on Obama, is that Obama's are overwhelmingly accurate and backed up by facts. Hillary's are often gross distortions or blatant attempts to create a false impression upon the voters. But there's a reason Hillary was within about 7% of Bush for being despised by Americans (very unfavorable/strong disapproval).
--
Glock21 Op/Ed