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Posted May 29th, 2008 at 09:59 PM by Joan Dykstra

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On May 29th, 2008 at 10:02 PM, Joan Dykstra said:

On May 30th, 2008 at 07:25 AM, xian said:

That's true, if the press were as hard on Obama as they were on people who had ten times as many gaffes as him, like Quayle or Bush, then he'd just be like them--no chance of being elected to higher office for 12 years.

On May 30th, 2008 at 07:58 AM, Adam said:

Plus, Dan Quayle's gaffes were over important matters such as how to spell potato. Obama just has slips of the tongue, brief mental lapses (probably caused by all the racist attacks against him by the white privileged). For example, his repeated statements that we need to send expert farmers to Afghanistan to teach those people how to grow something other than poppy. If only they were educated, they could grow things like spinach and corn instead. Unlike Quayle's many many gaffes, such as how to spell potato, just to name a few, which indicate a deep misunderstanding of the realities around the world, Obama's brief mental lapse can be attributed to having to campaign so much against Hillary "White supremacy" Clinton. The media are smart enough to realize this, which is why they correctly decide not to dwell on these things.

On May 30th, 2008 at 08:09 AM, another.anonymous (not verified) said:

That's true, if the press were as hard on Obama as they were on people who had ten times as many gaffes as him, like Quayle or Bush, then he'd just be like them--

Umm, Obama has had quite a few gaffes, misspeaks (I love that one by politicians), and just plain goofy comments and we've only gotten to know him in the last year!

On May 30th, 2008 at 08:30 AM, Glock21 said:

Bush was the 'king of gaffes' by the time the 2000 campaign was over. His name is practically synonymous with gaffe... especially gaffes with made up words. 'Bushisms.' The problem with some of Obama's "gaffes" is that they didn't appear to be misspeaking or unintential, but actually just trying to pander, deceive or stating policy that's simply naive or contradictory. The silly goof ups are funny and make good late night fodder from any politician. When the "gaffes" appear more reflective of an incoherent policy or being deceptive, then it gets to be more than a joke.

Glock21 Op/Ed

On May 30th, 2008 at 08:34 AM, Kevin Sandefur said:

"we've only gotten to know him in the last year!"

I give up. What state do you live in?

On May 30th, 2008 at 10:36 AM, akibare said:

FWIW Dan Quayle's "potatoe" was the equivalent of the "Dean Scream." He was given a spelling bee card that said "potatoe" on it by the teacher, and had to decide if he'd make the kid spell to the card, or fix the card (and basically call out the teacher as wrong).

He chose badly.

Of course even he points out that it worked as a bad press moment due to already forming conceptions of him, but that's true of the "Dean Scream" also.

On May 30th, 2008 at 11:59 AM, D. Boon said:

Well this is an interesting thread. I wasn't aware that any of Obama's gaffes were being ignored by the media. Should we have spent the entire spring discussing the "bitter" comments, or was a whole month long enough? Should we still be discussing Rev. Wright, or was a two month news cycle sufficient?

Are you guys just looking for distractions because your policy ideas absolutely suck, or because you are just dedicated to the idea that American politics should be really, really irrelevant and shallow?

On May 30th, 2008 at 12:11 PM, Adam said:

The "bitter" comments? Oh, you must be talking about the "poor white people get angry so they go to church, shoot guns, and get racist because they are frustrated that the government doesn't help them more" comment.

Interesting point you made, Boon, that even when the media cover an Obama "gaffe" that they spin it in a way that really minimizes the severity or offensiveness of it. I guess the bias goes deeper than we thought.

On May 30th, 2008 at 12:15 PM, redstatewannabe said:

I wasn't aware that any of Obama's gaffes were being ignored by the media. Should we have spent the entire spring discussing the "bitter" comments, or was a whole month long enough? Should we still be discussing Rev. Wright, or was a two month news cycle sufficient?

Do those qualify as "gaffes"?

On May 30th, 2008 at 01:16 PM, xian said:

You are the king of unintentional irony. Who does this: attacks someone for correctly paraphrasing a quote by directly fabricating a false version of the quote.

Glock, Adam's done more to win us the argument about the right's irrational hatred of Obama than anything I could tell you, huh?

On May 30th, 2008 at 02:07 PM, Adam said:

Ok, here's the Obama quote. We'll let everyone decide whose portrayal of it was more accurate and complete.

BTW, what exactly is the argument about the right's irrational hatred of Obama? I bet it's nothing compared to the Left's very informed and rational disapproval of Bushitler.

OBAMA: So, it depends on where you are, but I think it's fair to say that the places where we are going to have to do the most work are the places where people are most cynical about government. The people are mis-appre...they're misunderstanding why the demographics in our, in this contest have broken out as they are. Because everybody just ascribes it to 'white working-class don't wanna work — don't wanna vote for the black guy.' That's...there were intimations of that in an article in the Sunday New York Times today - kind of implies that it's sort of a race thing.

Here's how it is: in a lot of these communities in big industrial states like Ohio and Pennsylvania, people have been beaten down so long. They feel so betrayed by government that when they hear a pitch that is premised on not being cynical about government, then a part of them just doesn't buy it. And when it's delivered by — it's true that when it's delivered by a 46-year-old black man named Barack Obama, then that adds another layer of skepticism.

But — so the questions you're most likely to get about me, 'Well, what is this guy going to do for me? What is the concrete thing?' What they wanna hear is — so, we'll give you talking points about what we're proposing — to close tax loopholes, you know, roll back the tax cuts for the top 1 percent. Obama's gonna give tax breaks to middle-class folks and we're gonna provide health care for every American.

But the truth is, is that, our challenge is to get people persuaded that we can make progress when there's not evidence of that in their daily lives. You go into some of these small towns in Pennsylvania, and like a lot of small towns in the Midwest, the jobs have been gone now for 25 years and nothing's replaced them. And they fell through the Clinton administration, and the Bush administration, and each successive administration has said that somehow these communities are gonna regenerate and they have not. And it's not surprising then they get bitter, they cling to guns or religion or antipathy to people who aren't like them or anti-immigrant sentiment or anti-trade sentiment as a way to explain their frustrations.
Um, now these are in some communities, you know. I think what you'll find is, is that people of every background — there are gonna be a mix of people, you can go in the toughest neighborhoods, you know working-class lunch-pail folks, you'll find Obama enthusiasts. And you can go into places where you think I'd be very strong and people will just be skeptical. The important thing is that you show up and you're doing what you're doing.

On May 30th, 2008 at 02:24 PM, Glock21 said:

xian... Well Obama supporters and Obama detractors often see the bitter comments very differently. I had one of my notoriously long comments after that... but there's really no point. I've said it all before, you've said it all before, they've said it all before. The other thread appears to be well on its way to devolving to it's own little race riot anyways, I don't see any reason to help this one follow suit.

Friday funny: On my way home from the 'welcome home' event this morning I got scared half to death. While pulling out to make a left turn onto a busy road, my passenger suddenly and excitedly blurted out, "CAR!" and something that sounded like 'paidium.' I missed that last bit as my stomach dropped with the sudden realization I was about to be road kill.

Fortunately, as it turns out there was no problem, but in response to my muttering about trying to take my chances in getting through the traffic, my passenger was merely telling me to 'seize the day' in latin.

Died laughing instead moments later.

Glock21 Op/Ed

On May 30th, 2008 at 03:28 PM, Champaign Dweller said:

O.K., those of you who are Obama supporters. Let's look at what he's accomplished either for Illinois while in the state senate, or while in the US senate. When we really start examining his accomplishments, or lack thereof, I think you'll be happy to go back to talking about his gaffes.

On May 30th, 2008 at 09:18 PM, xian said:

You go into some of these small towns in Pennsylvania, and like a lot of small towns in the Midwest, the jobs have been gone now for 25 years and nothing's replaced them. And they fell through the Clinton administration, and the Bush administration, and each successive administration has said that somehow these communities are gonna regenerate and they have not. And it's not surprising then they get bitter, they cling to guns or religion or antipathy to people who aren't like them or anti-immigrant sentiment or anti-trade sentiment as a way to explain their frustrations.

The above is what Adam bolded and the below is his paraphrasing...except for the sex with goats part which I made up. That's why I didn't put it in quote. The man actually yelled at someone who referred to the "'bitter' comments" which of course is what Obama actually said. Then he made up a bunch of crap and put that in quotes.

How can you possibly defend that, Glock? I expect more of you.

On May 30th, 2008 at 10:18 PM, Adam said:

If you're upset about the quotes, let me be clear, I was trying to provide a more complete description of what Obama said not quote him word for word. The quotes around my statement indicated that the contents inside the statement were the label I was using for Obama's quote instead of the label "bitter". Sorry for all the confusion. All I was really trying to say was that calling Obama's statement the "bitter" statement misses the real objectionable part of what he said. It's not Boon who characterized the comment, it's the MSM, which I pointed out. So again, sorry about all the confusion.

By the way, what part of the "crap" that I made up and put in quotes misrepresents what Obama said? You know, I'm just trying to be rational here.

On May 30th, 2008 at 10:21 PM, Glock21 said:

My comment was intended to stay out of this mind numbing racial angst that erupts time and time again... not to defend either perspective, nor to defend or condone, or even really give a crap whether he appropriately used double/single punctuation marks for a paraphrase or anything else for that matter.

To avoid any further confusion on my feelings about the "bitter" debate: I don't care what Adam said. I don't care what you said. I don't care what Obama said or what anyone else said about what Obama said. I'd rather boil my eyeballs out with a soldering iron than have this bitter discussion again. We all know where it ends:

***I'm a racist, you're a racist, he, she, them, they are racists. He lied, she lied, you're spinning, I'm spinning, that guy should stop being white, that guy should stop being black, you should stop being asian... zomg how dare he, she, you, I, anger anger anger, spite spite spite, insult insult insult.***

Yay... I'm glad it's out of the way now. Can we talk about something funny now? There's a perfectly good racial division cyber-fist fight in another thread where nobody understands anybody else and everybody knows the other guy is an ignorant racist dope. Excuse me while I go beat my inner child.

Glock21 Op/Ed

On June 1st, 2008 at 04:08 PM, Green_Cutip said: