Illinois needs more accountability for corruption, not less. Blago Chavez is probably already drafting his pardon petition and learning to fake an illness.
George Ryan Inmate #16627-424, should serve His entire sentence, He had no respect for His office or His family. The Ryan's lived the high life on the taxpayers dime and now they are paying the price. Ryan's not the first Governor we have sent to prison, and He will not be the last!!! Like I posted in another thread, "Have a miserable life in the slam George"
On December 1st, 2008 at 02:21 PM, wglithero (not verified) said:
I agree entirely with the previous posts. Elected officials should be held to a higher standard, not lower than we regular mortals. Why should we allow someone who profits from misdeeds at the taxpayer's expense even be considered for a pardon? Only in Illinois. (at the state level at least)
On December 1st, 2008 at 03:17 PM, Anonymous (not verified) said:
Geez - have a heart. The man is old, sick and broken. Besides it's Chrismas.
Blago on the other hand is young and could perhaps learn a trade during his incarceration.
On December 1st, 2008 at 03:40 PM, Robert Dunn said:
Sheesh Anonymous 3:17PM, how ageist! So, an old politician breaks the law and we should let him go because he is old, sick, and broken? Well what about the folks who ended up broken by his giving licenses for bribes. How about this, we just reimplement the Death Penalty and George Ryan is the person to test if the lethal injection is still lethal or if the electric chair can still crank out a few volts. Would that be the Death Penalty or Euthanasia. Depending on your perspective, the moral dilemma could be of the right vs. the left. The Left would cry about the Death Penalty and the Right could cry about Euthanasia.
Execution is the only method to solve putting Ryan out of our and his own personal misery. Ship him to Texas!
On December 1st, 2008 at 04:06 PM, Bruce Byrd said:
Mr. Dunn: you unlock this door with the key of imagination. Beyond is another dimension, of sound, of sight, of mind. You're moving into a land of both shadow and substance, of things and ideas. You've just crossed over into..........The Twilight Zone.
On December 1st, 2008 at 06:41 PM, xian said:
There are plenty of youth in asia.
On December 1st, 2008 at 10:03 PM, AnonymousMe said:
How about this, we just reimplement the Death Penalty and George Ryan is the person to test if the lethal injection is still lethal or if the electric chair can still crank out a few volts.
The Republicans were trounced in the national elections because enough of the population feared those Republicans who have the same world view as Mr. Dunn
On December 1st, 2008 at 10:49 PM, Anonymous (not verified) said:
We've been hearing for what, 6-7 years, that Blago's indictment is imminent? When did then change the meaning of imminent?
On December 1st, 2008 at 10:55 PM, Glock21 said:
Anon... I'm not sure 'imminent' would be the right word (and I don't see it used here other than by you). 'Inevitable' is probably more accurate to describe the opinion of those who think the federal investigation that involves him is likely to turn up some damning dirt.
On December 1st, 2008 at 11:20 PM, Anonymous (not verified) said:
Ridiculous. We paid big $$ to have prosecutors nail him. Complete affront to discuss releasing him early. Insult to injury.
On December 2nd, 2008 at 09:51 AM, Anonymous (not verified) said:
Maybe it's time you all opened up your old junk drawers, toss in your "Live Strong" bracelets, and pull out the "What Would Jesus Do?" bracelets.
But harsh treatment is the norm around here.
So, since I assume all of you think that public officials should be expected to act at an even higher level than the rest of us mere mortals, how long of a jail sentence do you think the Champaign Police detective should do for drunk driving, the wrong way on the interstate, at 3:00 am, in a city owned unmarked squad car?
On December 2nd, 2008 at 10:00 AM, Anonymous (not verified) said:
"how long of a jail sentence do you think the Champaign Police detective should do for drunk driving, the wrong way on the interstate, at 3:00 am, in a city owned unmarked squad car?"
Well, the state fire marshall got stopped for DUI at 2:30 am in a state vehicle with a female passenger who was not related to him. He lost his license for 6 months so the state provided a driver so he could get to and from work. Maybe the city could do the same for her.
On December 2nd, 2008 at 10:11 AM, Anonymous (not verified) said:
"Well, the state fire marshall got stopped for DUI"
Not in Champaign County. This is clearly a case that calls for jail time, just like anyone else who did this in Champaign County. Being the toughest county in the state should mean the same for everyone, unless you are a public official who has as part of the job upholding the law, not breaking it. Then it should go way way up, shouldn't it?
On December 2nd, 2008 at 10:21 AM, Anonymous (not verified) said:
Then it should go way way up, shouldn't it?
No, it should be the same.
On December 2nd, 2008 at 10:39 AM, Anonymous (not verified) said:
Then it should go way way up, shouldn't it?
No, it should be the same.
Oh really?
Sorry, if politicians are held to a higher standard, cops should very much be held to a higher standard.
The cost to taxpayers of Ryan's prosecution has been raised as an issue about not commuting Ryan's sentence. What would the cost have been to the taxpayers of Champaign if the detective had an accident and killed somebody? What is the cost today of having the detective on paid leave? Why paid?
It's always hard to pick and choose when to be understanding, when to be compassionate, unless there is a bandwagon (Don't let Ryan out!) to jump on. The mob mentality is never a good thing, always a bad thing.
My point is, where is some compassion for someone who screws up, loses everything, and just wants to die at home instead of in prison?
What is the real dollar cost for keeping someone in prison who is old and in failing health?
Why is it so easy to be judgmental and harsh, and why is it so hard to be compassionate about someone who has made a very bad mistake and who has already paid a far greater price than most could endure?
"No man stands so tall as when he stoops to pick up the fallen".
On December 2nd, 2008 at 11:03 AM, Glock21 said:
"Why is it so easy to be judgmental and harsh, and why is it so hard to be compassionate about someone who has made a very bad mistake and who has already paid a far greater price than most could endure?"
His mistakes led to the deaths of others. Greater price? Bah. He got off easy on that one due to the indirect nature of the situation. It's not being judgmental and harsh to agree with the results of a fair trial in which he was given due process before his liberty was stripped of him. It has nothing to do with the cost. It has to do with the rule of law and ensuring that elected officials get the message that corruption and violating the public trust to abuse their position will not be tolerated.
Tunnel-vision compassion doesn't sound like a virtue in this case.
On December 2nd, 2008 at 11:14 AM, Anonymous (not verified) said:
Tunnel-vision compassion doesn't sound like a virtue in this case.
I have never heard of "tunnel-vision" compassion. I haven't heard it in my church, I haven't read it in my Bible, I never heard it in school, I really have never heard of it before. Is it something new?
I'm not saying let him off, give him back his pension, remake him into what he is not. I'm saying let the old, broken man go home to his modest house to be with his ailing wife, be forced to live off the kindness of others, die a quiet death, and close yet another chapter of corrupt Illinois politics.
On December 2nd, 2008 at 12:03 PM, Glock21 said:
I was using tunnel-vision as a descriptor for the compassion you seem to be demanding. It looks at Ryan as if your compassionate requests happen in a vacuum where it doesn't adversely affect others by doing so. You seem to think his punishment is unduly harsh because of his age, but such arguments were made during his sentencing and he has not been denied due process with the decision. He is being punished when he is old for committing crimes later in his life. That's not the system being cruel, that's a criminal taking risks at an inconvenient time for him to face jail time. It isn't compassion to thwart the rule of law because of the bad timing of his criminal enterprises. It's not fair to his victims, both direct and indirect, nor does it help reinforce the legal risks involved in corruption by other elected officials, who generally seem to have the strange idea that the risks of corruption are low enough to be worth it... just as Ryan did.
There's more at stake than Ryan's lousy situation that he created for himself to consider when applying your compassion.
On December 2nd, 2008 at 02:22 PM, Keith_Hays said:
"What happens when you're seventy? When you're old and its cold and who cares if you live or you die? Your one consolation's the money you may have put by." Fagin sings in OLIVER!.
Well, George Ryan is seventy and then some. The money he "put by" is gone. So, too, is the system of corrupt administration in the Secretary of State's office that he inherited from Jim Edgar who inherited it from Charlie Carpentier who in turn inherited it from Paul Powell. That driver's license decisions were made "easier" by political contributions did not originate with George Ryan's election to that office. That job security in the Secretary of State's office depended on the number of fundraiser tickets did not start with George. Charlie and Paul are dead. George in in prison and Jim Edgar leaves his gated home on the banks of the Sangamon to profess public administration at the University of Illinois. Gifts from political friends (whose friendship has blossomed into the public business) is not made corrupt when the gift is of a Jamaica vacation rather than a sophisticated computer.
78 months to a healthy man in his youth is a literal lifetime to a 74 year old diabetic with a failing heart. Let him out? No never! Compassion? No Never! Christian Charity? No Never, Not at this time of year! Especially not at this time of year! Bah! Humbug!
3 Score + 10
Keith Hays
On December 2nd, 2008 at 02:35 PM, Anonymous (not verified) said:
A point well made in the above post, and lost on many, is that Ryan was prosecuted not only after he was Governor, but well after the deeds he did when he was Secretary of State.
There is no condoning his behavior as Secy of State, even if others did the same and he was just going along. But one should realize that the prosecution of an old man for the deeds done when he was a young man has its flaws. Now, an old, broken, unhealthy man pays the price for actions done by him and others that were committed many years ago.
Should he be punished? Yes, he should go to prison. He should lose his pension. He should forever be known as a corrupt politician, a stain never to be removed. But should he (probably) die in prison for what he did many years ago? I do not think so. But then again, I was raised in a church where forgiveness is a centerpiece of belief. I am a Christian.
On December 2nd, 2008 at 02:52 PM, Bruce Byrd said:
Charlie was before Paul,,,,,Ryan collected $800,000 before he lost it,,,his wife has been given a plum to serve on the Lincoln Commisson,,,,,a nice little stipend,,,,,,,they still have a nice pot from selling the family drug stores,,,,and they have six kids, I took care of my mom with Altzheimers,,,,,at home for the last three years of her life with far less resources and no help. Ryan should serve out his term,,,,,he earned every day of it, he has shown no remorse, indeed he feels like he has not done anything wrong. He will not serve the full 6 and half years anyway, they will let him out in maybe 12 months. Let the legal system run its course. Lura Lynn is no more special than any other elderly lady that is failing in health. When they were living high on the hog, they should have thought about it.
On December 2nd, 2008 at 03:58 PM, Anonymous (not verified) said:
He will serve most of the 6 and 1/2, no day for day good time in the Federal system.
On December 2nd, 2008 at 05:36 PM, Anonymous (not verified) said:
Here's a question: If Ryan was not the former governor, but an everyday felon, would this conversation be had? Answer: probably not. My point is, if the powers that be feel that a felon's sentence should be commuted because he's old and his wife is in ill health, then every felon's sentence should be commuted on those grounds. I am not sure that he should necessarily be held to a higher standard, but he surely shouldn't be held to a lower one. If it's good for him, it should be good for every criminal in a similar circumstance. When will Senator Durbin and others be making that request for commutation?
On December 2nd, 2008 at 05:39 PM, San Simeon said:
Isnt there parole in the federal system? I think that there is still good time credit if your sentence is less than X but I am not sure. Personally Iwould like to throw George out only when its Blago's turn to go in.... jeff skilling got a sentence that will be keeping him in jail until he is 90... should he get out when he is 70+ because he is old??????
On December 2nd, 2008 at 05:57 PM, Glock21 said:
I feel strangely comfortable in my cold, heartless, scrooge-like, war on christmas battle against giving politicians special treatment for their crimes. Hmm. It's almost as if I'm immune to the compassionate guilt-tripping technique. I must be a monster! :-)
On December 2nd, 2008 at 07:08 PM, Anonymous (not verified) said:
Compare a hypothetical.
In 1978, Jim forged a prescription and got some drugs. He sold some of the drugs to his friend Bill. Bill gave some to Susie, and Susie died. Jim went on to become a surgeon and saved many lives. In 2008, Bill is dying and makes a complete deathbed confession about Susie and Jim, with airtight proof. There is a Statute of Limitations for selling drugs, but there is no Statute of Limitations for Forgery. Dr. Jim is 70 years old and is in bad health, he expects to pass on within 2 years.
Do you throw Dr. Jim in prison and let him die there?
An old bad thing, many others have done it, someone died because of unexpected events, Jim has prospered, he has helped many, and he may be near death.
Just like George Ryan.
On December 2nd, 2008 at 07:52 PM, Anonymous (not verified) said:
Do you throw Dr. Jim in prison and let him die there?
No, because Bill, having passed on, cannot testify at a trial
Just like George Ryan
Comvince us that George Ryan did enough compensating good.
On December 2nd, 2008 at 08:04 PM, Glock21 said:
Anon... you're comparing apples and oranges and doing so on irrelevant levels of the scenario. Ryan's situation was taken into consideration at sentencing just as your example's would be. Given all of the possible variables that may be additionally considered they may not have the same result even for the same charge and age/health issues.
On December 2nd, 2008 at 09:19 PM, Dan Fielding said:
Just once, I would like to see "compassion" urged in politics not as a cheap ploy.
On December 3rd, 2008 at 06:25 AM, Anonymous (not verified) said:
Why not treat George Ryan just like most prisoners? When Durbin starts lobbying to commute the sentence of old bank robbers and crack dealers, hten he can also throw in a good word for a guy who sold his public office, making me one of his victims. The George Ryan sentence was not particularly long, George just had the cojones to continue committing federal crimes when he was in his golden years. No doubt Lura Lynn wants her hubby home now; she should have turned him in when she was spending the graft he was taking.
On December 3rd, 2008 at 02:45 PM, pattsi said:
Two thumbs down for Durbin right now--the Ryan pardon plus voting for the bailout. I know that he garnered a huge vote in the last election, but he is not "ironman."
Pattsi Petrie
On December 3rd, 2008 at 03:23 PM, Local Voter said:
Durbin's right. Let Ryan out---no pension. Let him pay for his own upkeep instead of the State of Illinois.
On December 3rd, 2008 at 03:40 PM, redstatewannabe said:
Why Durbin doesn't just wait for Pres. Obama? There is no rule against pardons and commutations in the first 30 days in office. Yes, Bush and Ryan are both Republicans, but Durbin hasn't exactly won a lot of brownie points with GW.
On December 3rd, 2008 at 08:21 PM, Run4cvrlib said:
I think the idea is to give Ryan a pardon so they can give themselves cover when they give Blago a break and yank Fitzgerald.
On December 3rd, 2008 at 10:24 PM, Kevin Sandefur said:
1) How does pardoning Ryan give anyone cover?
2) Fitzgerald will not be yanked. The word has already gone out that he can have another term if he wants it. At this point, it's pretty much up to him.
On December 4th, 2008 at 05:08 AM, Run4cvrlib said:
Quid Pro Quo you watch, Fitz, will "want" to be reassigned to a better position after Obama asks him quietly to do so and the media will start talking about how people didn't care when people talked about Ryan being pardoned. Maybe it won't work now that everyone is against Ryan’s pardon, don’t forget Obama came from the same Chicago machine as Rezko and Blago.
On December 4th, 2008 at 08:09 AM, Kevin Sandefur said:
Maybe we should start calling you "Stretch."
;-)
On December 4th, 2008 at 12:13 PM, Run4cvrlib said:
I'm to short, but it may fit. I just can't see Fitz, going much longer.
On December 4th, 2008 at 12:21 PM, IlliniPundit said:
The only way that Fitzgerald is going away is if he doesn't think he has enough evidence to convict Blagojevich, and if he has no other angles under which to continue investigating him. I don't think he will come to either conclusion soon.
In short, I think he'll stick around until the Blagojevich case is resolved, either with an indictment and trial or by quietly admitting there's not enough to indict.
On December 4th, 2008 at 04:25 PM, one who hopes t... said:
Anon, would you please come out and admit you're shilling for Ryan, and possibly Blago, too?
George Ryan's corruption led to the horrific deaths of the six Willis children. These children, ages just a few weeks to teenager, burned to death on an expressway in Wisconsin because a semi-truck driver who had purchased his license in Illinois from a Ryan underling failed to pull over and fix his broken truck.
Admittedly, I'm passionate about this topic because I got to see my little brother spend five weeks in the burn unit almost 25 years ago. He still bears physical and emotional scars from his experience.
But, hey, if you're willing to allow me to push George Ryan and Dean Bauer (who's already finished his sentence, thank you very much!) and a few other of these schmucks in a gas-fueled fire so that they can feel the torment those innocent children felt before the children died, then I'll agree to a commutation.
Ryan got almost $800,000 from his state pension and a full life. Only three of Scott and Janet Willis' kids lived past the age of 16.
Who deserves our compassion?
And who still refuses to apologize for the anguish he caused others besides his wife (who's now trying to live with the reality that they aren't going to have $12,000/month in pension income from the State of Illinois)?
The one who hopes...
P.S. Glock: love your new signature!!
On December 25th, 2008 at 05:56 PM, Ed McBroom (not verified) said:
If Durban wants Ryan pardoned, let him ask Obama to do it. If the act is too dirty for Obama to perform, maybe it shouldn't be done.
Illinois needs more accountability for corruption, not less. Blago Chavez is probably already drafting his pardon petition and learning to fake an illness.
--
Glock21 Op/Ed
George Ryan Inmate #16627-424, should serve His entire sentence, He had no respect for His office or His family. The Ryan's lived the high life on the taxpayers dime and now they are paying the price. Ryan's not the first Governor we have sent to prison, and He will not be the last!!! Like I posted in another thread, "Have a miserable life in the slam George"
I agree entirely with the previous posts. Elected officials should be held to a higher standard, not lower than we regular mortals. Why should we allow someone who profits from misdeeds at the taxpayer's expense even be considered for a pardon? Only in Illinois. (at the state level at least)
Geez - have a heart. The man is old, sick and broken. Besides it's Chrismas.
Blago on the other hand is young and could perhaps learn a trade during his incarceration.
Sheesh Anonymous 3:17PM, how ageist! So, an old politician breaks the law and we should let him go because he is old, sick, and broken? Well what about the folks who ended up broken by his giving licenses for bribes. How about this, we just reimplement the Death Penalty and George Ryan is the person to test if the lethal injection is still lethal or if the electric chair can still crank out a few volts. Would that be the Death Penalty or Euthanasia. Depending on your perspective, the moral dilemma could be of the right vs. the left. The Left would cry about the Death Penalty and the Right could cry about Euthanasia.
Execution is the only method to solve putting Ryan out of our and his own personal misery. Ship him to Texas!
Mr. Dunn: you unlock this door with the key of imagination. Beyond is another dimension, of sound, of sight, of mind. You're moving into a land of both shadow and substance, of things and ideas. You've just crossed over into..........The Twilight Zone.
There are plenty of youth in asia.
How about this, we just reimplement the Death Penalty and George Ryan is the person to test if the lethal injection is still lethal or if the electric chair can still crank out a few volts.
The Republicans were trounced in the national elections because enough of the population feared those Republicans who have the same world view as Mr. Dunn
We've been hearing for what, 6-7 years, that Blago's indictment is imminent? When did then change the meaning of imminent?
Anon... I'm not sure 'imminent' would be the right word (and I don't see it used here other than by you). 'Inevitable' is probably more accurate to describe the opinion of those who think the federal investigation that involves him is likely to turn up some damning dirt.
--
Glock21 Op/Ed
Ridiculous. We paid big $$ to have prosecutors nail him. Complete affront to discuss releasing him early. Insult to injury.
Maybe it's time you all opened up your old junk drawers, toss in your "Live Strong" bracelets, and pull out the "What Would Jesus Do?" bracelets.
But harsh treatment is the norm around here.
So, since I assume all of you think that public officials should be expected to act at an even higher level than the rest of us mere mortals, how long of a jail sentence do you think the Champaign Police detective should do for drunk driving, the wrong way on the interstate, at 3:00 am, in a city owned unmarked squad car?
"how long of a jail sentence do you think the Champaign Police detective should do for drunk driving, the wrong way on the interstate, at 3:00 am, in a city owned unmarked squad car?"
Well, the state fire marshall got stopped for DUI at 2:30 am in a state vehicle with a female passenger who was not related to him. He lost his license for 6 months so the state provided a driver so he could get to and from work. Maybe the city could do the same for her.
"Well, the state fire marshall got stopped for DUI"
Not in Champaign County. This is clearly a case that calls for jail time, just like anyone else who did this in Champaign County. Being the toughest county in the state should mean the same for everyone, unless you are a public official who has as part of the job upholding the law, not breaking it. Then it should go way way up, shouldn't it?
Then it should go way way up, shouldn't it?
No, it should be the same.
Then it should go way way up, shouldn't it?
No, it should be the same.
Oh really?
Sorry, if politicians are held to a higher standard, cops should very much be held to a higher standard.
The cost to taxpayers of Ryan's prosecution has been raised as an issue about not commuting Ryan's sentence. What would the cost have been to the taxpayers of Champaign if the detective had an accident and killed somebody? What is the cost today of having the detective on paid leave? Why paid?
It's always hard to pick and choose when to be understanding, when to be compassionate, unless there is a bandwagon (Don't let Ryan out!) to jump on. The mob mentality is never a good thing, always a bad thing.
My point is, where is some compassion for someone who screws up, loses everything, and just wants to die at home instead of in prison?
What is the real dollar cost for keeping someone in prison who is old and in failing health?
Why is it so easy to be judgmental and harsh, and why is it so hard to be compassionate about someone who has made a very bad mistake and who has already paid a far greater price than most could endure?
"No man stands so tall as when he stoops to pick up the fallen".
"Why is it so easy to be judgmental and harsh, and why is it so hard to be compassionate about someone who has made a very bad mistake and who has already paid a far greater price than most could endure?"
His mistakes led to the deaths of others. Greater price? Bah. He got off easy on that one due to the indirect nature of the situation. It's not being judgmental and harsh to agree with the results of a fair trial in which he was given due process before his liberty was stripped of him. It has nothing to do with the cost. It has to do with the rule of law and ensuring that elected officials get the message that corruption and violating the public trust to abuse their position will not be tolerated.
Tunnel-vision compassion doesn't sound like a virtue in this case.
--
Glock21 Op/Ed
Tunnel-vision compassion doesn't sound like a virtue in this case.
I have never heard of "tunnel-vision" compassion. I haven't heard it in my church, I haven't read it in my Bible, I never heard it in school, I really have never heard of it before. Is it something new?
I'm not saying let him off, give him back his pension, remake him into what he is not. I'm saying let the old, broken man go home to his modest house to be with his ailing wife, be forced to live off the kindness of others, die a quiet death, and close yet another chapter of corrupt Illinois politics.
I was using tunnel-vision as a descriptor for the compassion you seem to be demanding. It looks at Ryan as if your compassionate requests happen in a vacuum where it doesn't adversely affect others by doing so. You seem to think his punishment is unduly harsh because of his age, but such arguments were made during his sentencing and he has not been denied due process with the decision. He is being punished when he is old for committing crimes later in his life. That's not the system being cruel, that's a criminal taking risks at an inconvenient time for him to face jail time. It isn't compassion to thwart the rule of law because of the bad timing of his criminal enterprises. It's not fair to his victims, both direct and indirect, nor does it help reinforce the legal risks involved in corruption by other elected officials, who generally seem to have the strange idea that the risks of corruption are low enough to be worth it... just as Ryan did.
There's more at stake than Ryan's lousy situation that he created for himself to consider when applying your compassion.
--
Glock21 Op/Ed
"What happens when you're seventy? When you're old and its cold and who cares if you live or you die? Your one consolation's the money you may have put by." Fagin sings in OLIVER!.
Well, George Ryan is seventy and then some. The money he "put by" is gone. So, too, is the system of corrupt administration in the Secretary of State's office that he inherited from Jim Edgar who inherited it from Charlie Carpentier who in turn inherited it from Paul Powell. That driver's license decisions were made "easier" by political contributions did not originate with George Ryan's election to that office. That job security in the Secretary of State's office depended on the number of fundraiser tickets did not start with George. Charlie and Paul are dead. George in in prison and Jim Edgar leaves his gated home on the banks of the Sangamon to profess public administration at the University of Illinois. Gifts from political friends (whose friendship has blossomed into the public business) is not made corrupt when the gift is of a Jamaica vacation rather than a sophisticated computer.
78 months to a healthy man in his youth is a literal lifetime to a 74 year old diabetic with a failing heart. Let him out? No never! Compassion? No Never! Christian Charity? No Never, Not at this time of year! Especially not at this time of year! Bah! Humbug!
3 Score + 10
Keith Hays
A point well made in the above post, and lost on many, is that Ryan was prosecuted not only after he was Governor, but well after the deeds he did when he was Secretary of State.
There is no condoning his behavior as Secy of State, even if others did the same and he was just going along. But one should realize that the prosecution of an old man for the deeds done when he was a young man has its flaws. Now, an old, broken, unhealthy man pays the price for actions done by him and others that were committed many years ago.
Should he be punished? Yes, he should go to prison. He should lose his pension. He should forever be known as a corrupt politician, a stain never to be removed. But should he (probably) die in prison for what he did many years ago? I do not think so. But then again, I was raised in a church where forgiveness is a centerpiece of belief. I am a Christian.
Charlie was before Paul,,,,,Ryan collected $800,000 before he lost it,,,his wife has been given a plum to serve on the Lincoln Commisson,,,,,a nice little stipend,,,,,,,they still have a nice pot from selling the family drug stores,,,,and they have six kids, I took care of my mom with Altzheimers,,,,,at home for the last three years of her life with far less resources and no help. Ryan should serve out his term,,,,,he earned every day of it, he has shown no remorse, indeed he feels like he has not done anything wrong. He will not serve the full 6 and half years anyway, they will let him out in maybe 12 months. Let the legal system run its course. Lura Lynn is no more special than any other elderly lady that is failing in health. When they were living high on the hog, they should have thought about it.
He will serve most of the 6 and 1/2, no day for day good time in the Federal system.
Here's a question: If Ryan was not the former governor, but an everyday felon, would this conversation be had? Answer: probably not. My point is, if the powers that be feel that a felon's sentence should be commuted because he's old and his wife is in ill health, then every felon's sentence should be commuted on those grounds. I am not sure that he should necessarily be held to a higher standard, but he surely shouldn't be held to a lower one. If it's good for him, it should be good for every criminal in a similar circumstance. When will Senator Durbin and others be making that request for commutation?
Isnt there parole in the federal system? I think that there is still good time credit if your sentence is less than X but I am not sure. Personally Iwould like to throw George out only when its Blago's turn to go in.... jeff skilling got a sentence that will be keeping him in jail until he is 90... should he get out when he is 70+ because he is old??????
I feel strangely comfortable in my cold, heartless, scrooge-like, war on christmas battle against giving politicians special treatment for their crimes. Hmm. It's almost as if I'm immune to the compassionate guilt-tripping technique. I must be a monster! :-)
--
Glock21 Op/Ed
Compare a hypothetical.
In 1978, Jim forged a prescription and got some drugs. He sold some of the drugs to his friend Bill. Bill gave some to Susie, and Susie died. Jim went on to become a surgeon and saved many lives. In 2008, Bill is dying and makes a complete deathbed confession about Susie and Jim, with airtight proof. There is a Statute of Limitations for selling drugs, but there is no Statute of Limitations for Forgery. Dr. Jim is 70 years old and is in bad health, he expects to pass on within 2 years.
Do you throw Dr. Jim in prison and let him die there?
An old bad thing, many others have done it, someone died because of unexpected events, Jim has prospered, he has helped many, and he may be near death.
Just like George Ryan.
Do you throw Dr. Jim in prison and let him die there?
No, because Bill, having passed on, cannot testify at a trial
Just like George Ryan
Comvince us that George Ryan did enough compensating good.
Anon... you're comparing apples and oranges and doing so on irrelevant levels of the scenario. Ryan's situation was taken into consideration at sentencing just as your example's would be. Given all of the possible variables that may be additionally considered they may not have the same result even for the same charge and age/health issues.
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Glock21: Killer of Old People, Destroyer of Chritsmas, Scrooge of the Immortal Souls of Innocent Puppies!
Just once, I would like to see "compassion" urged in politics not as a cheap ploy.
Why not treat George Ryan just like most prisoners? When Durbin starts lobbying to commute the sentence of old bank robbers and crack dealers, hten he can also throw in a good word for a guy who sold his public office, making me one of his victims. The George Ryan sentence was not particularly long, George just had the cojones to continue committing federal crimes when he was in his golden years. No doubt Lura Lynn wants her hubby home now; she should have turned him in when she was spending the graft he was taking.
Two thumbs down for Durbin right now--the Ryan pardon plus voting for the bailout. I know that he garnered a huge vote in the last election, but he is not "ironman."
Pattsi Petrie
Durbin's right. Let Ryan out---no pension. Let him pay for his own upkeep instead of the State of Illinois.
Why Durbin doesn't just wait for Pres. Obama? There is no rule against pardons and commutations in the first 30 days in office. Yes, Bush and Ryan are both Republicans, but Durbin hasn't exactly won a lot of brownie points with GW.
I think the idea is to give Ryan a pardon so they can give themselves cover when they give Blago a break and yank Fitzgerald.
1) How does pardoning Ryan give anyone cover?
2) Fitzgerald will not be yanked. The word has already gone out that he can have another term if he wants it. At this point, it's pretty much up to him.
Quid Pro Quo you watch, Fitz, will "want" to be reassigned to a better position after Obama asks him quietly to do so and the media will start talking about how people didn't care when people talked about Ryan being pardoned. Maybe it won't work now that everyone is against Ryan’s pardon, don’t forget Obama came from the same Chicago machine as Rezko and Blago.
Maybe we should start calling you "Stretch."
;-)
I'm to short, but it may fit. I just can't see Fitz, going much longer.
The only way that Fitzgerald is going away is if he doesn't think he has enough evidence to convict Blagojevich, and if he has no other angles under which to continue investigating him. I don't think he will come to either conclusion soon.
In short, I think he'll stick around until the Blagojevich case is resolved, either with an indictment and trial or by quietly admitting there's not enough to indict.
Anon, would you please come out and admit you're shilling for Ryan, and possibly Blago, too?
George Ryan's corruption led to the horrific deaths of the six Willis children. These children, ages just a few weeks to teenager, burned to death on an expressway in Wisconsin because a semi-truck driver who had purchased his license in Illinois from a Ryan underling failed to pull over and fix his broken truck.
Admittedly, I'm passionate about this topic because I got to see my little brother spend five weeks in the burn unit almost 25 years ago. He still bears physical and emotional scars from his experience.
But, hey, if you're willing to allow me to push George Ryan and Dean Bauer (who's already finished his sentence, thank you very much!) and a few other of these schmucks in a gas-fueled fire so that they can feel the torment those innocent children felt before the children died, then I'll agree to a commutation.
Ryan got almost $800,000 from his state pension and a full life. Only three of Scott and Janet Willis' kids lived past the age of 16.
Who deserves our compassion?
And who still refuses to apologize for the anguish he caused others besides his wife (who's now trying to live with the reality that they aren't going to have $12,000/month in pension income from the State of Illinois)?
The one who hopes...
P.S. Glock: love your new signature!!
If Durban wants Ryan pardoned, let him ask Obama to do it. If the act is too dirty for Obama to perform, maybe it shouldn't be done.